BMW M50 Vanos Timing Angle in MS2Ex2.0.1 Seriously need help

[davebmw]

Hi all,

I hope you guys can help, I bloody hope so!
I have started to install my MS2V3.00 into my BMW 325i M50B25TU using my hardwired MS2 to 88 way Bosch motronic connector only to find that the settings i have scalped off the web don't work.
Do any of you guys know how to calculate the number 1 angle from the 60-2 wheel position i have tied loads of combinations of angles and all i have achieved is a very loud phut! out of the exhaust. Which concequntly was hysterical as it scared the living shit out of the neighbours kid and he ran into a parked car.....MS... brilliant!

Is it possible for someone to confirm the correct No1 trigger angle for my engine so I can start searching for the real problem, at the moment it seems like i'm chasing a hundred red herrings! fun as that may be, here in crappy south wales with no garage I am at the mercy of the even crappier weather which recently has been so crappy I havent been able to go out and play Please someone help me out.

I have confirmed that this unit works fine on the bench using the standard stim and various test equipment but he car disagrees, twat!

Your help is much appreciated, Dave

[jharvey]

and he ran into a parked car.....MS... brilliant!

You caught me off guard on that one. I loaded my britches when I read that. Nice image.

I can't help much about MS part, with out knowing very detailed info, that would be hard to convey via text. Perhaps a youtube would help?

[thebigmacd]

BMW M50 vanos (aka M50TU):

Wheel Decoder Settings:
Trigger A: 46
Trigger A return pos: 54
Trigger B: 6
Trigger B return pos: 14
Trigger C: 26
Trigger C return pos: 34

http://www.blowneuroz.com/forum/archive ... /t-14.html

[Fred]

Keith, that is the setup for MS1 isn't it?

For ms2e don't you just set the engine to TDC and measure the angle between the TDC marker and the first tooth after the missing one?

Either way Dave, you can do it empirically (and SHOULD always MS or FreeEMS verify it empirically) :

remove fuel via fuse, relay, or injector clips.
hold timing light
crank
observe angle
adjust
retry

If it's wasted spark that can get you 180 out too. If when you have it right via this method you get loud exhaust backfires and kids bouncing off local cars and power polls then subtract or add 180 to your figure.

I hope that helps.

Fred.

[thebigmacd]

Keith, that is the setup for MS1 isn't it?

For ms2e don't you just set the engine to TDC and measure the angle between the TDC marker and the first tooth after the missing one?

Either way Dave, you can do it empirically (and SHOULD always MS or FreeEMS verify it empirically) :

remove fuel via fuse, relay, or injector clips.
hold timing light
crank
observe angle
adjust
retry

If it's wasted spark that can get you 180 out too. If when you have it right via this method you get loud exhaust backfires and kids bouncing off local cars and power polls then subtract or add 180 to your figure.

I hope that helps.

Fred.

Fair enough. It's standard Bosch alignment with a twist (toothed wheel is advanced by one cylinder set), so take the angle used for the non-vanos engines and add 120.

[Fred]

I forgot to mention that you should have fixed timing of 0 or 10 or something convenient setup too. It's an option somewhere in the ignition settings I think.

Fred.

[davebmw]

OK thanks guys i'll give it another go this weekend, hopefully the weather will hold out for me so I can get under the car and measure angle from the timing mark, its either that or I have to take out the radiator and fan to get a good look. it's quite tight in there and the timing mark is right in an awkward spot behind the waterpump pulley.
The other option is fitting the No1 TDC locking pin in the flywheel but thats tricky when there's 1 pair of hands!

Timing light thats not a problem should be easy to trigger off the 1&6 coil mosfets.

By the looks the normal angle is 84 degrees - 120 for the VANOS should be looking at 324 degrees, but i will measure it to be sure.

And youtube would have been bloody brilliant for little bob next door I doubt if he'll do it again but I don't mind trying another gigantic backfire

[ababkin]

I know these loud scary backfires you talk about that result from way wrong trigger angle. (funny story with the kid there)

I think i've used 320degrees for the #1 trigger (or whatever it's called, it's been awhile) running ms2extra on my US S50 (essentially bored,stroked and cammed M50, not the real S50 you guys have in Europe )

But you need to get a version of firmware that supports more than 256 degrees for this value (when i tuned mine, i had to use alpha)

Then, i set MS to idle at some predetermined advance angle value and used the timegun to verify that timing is indeed what you put into MS while it was idling - was easy.
Put inductive pickup on the wires that come up to the coil, removing the protective rubber boot from them first. Wiggle it a little if it has trouble picking up signal.

Also i used a wire-hanger and whiteout trick to make marks

good luck
Alex

[Fred]

Then, i set MS to idle at some predetermined advance angle value and used the timegun to verify that timing is indeed what you put into MS while it was idling - was easy.

Don't forget to give it a rev once you have it correct and idling. If some settings are wrong you could get timing that moves a lot with RPM and or dwell.

Also i used a wire-hanger and whiteout trick to make marks

I used this trick on mops' e30 :-) Good timing marks are invaluable!

[AbeFM]

Pinning the cam sounds like a great way to go.

Anyway, all you need to know is where it thinks TDC is with the timing light, move it till you're close, then estimate the angle. You should be able to get within 15 degrees by eye.



When messing with my MS, I had a guy from 8 houses down and around the bend come over, looking half shell shocked, saying he wanted to know if everyone lived and that he hadn't heard an explosion like that since iraq.