Fred wrote:Just to expand upon that, I guess adding the pads for them is fine, provided there is space and it doesn't detract from some other aspect, BUT, the DEFAULT instructions/build/assembly/manufacture should definitely not have them. Make sense?
Thanks, I was going to say and do that in the thermistor circuits. You saved me valuable words :-)
Re the pullups, I had 680k resistors in mind, but if you're going to detect noise with software, you're most welcome.
We're probably not going to detect noise in software, but that's irrelevant so long as the default build, and one from a factory do not have these parts. It's part of setup/installation of the system to verify all connections and signals are good, basic stuff. Long term it's up to the owner/user to monitor their system and the way the car drives, detect and correct issues. A car with a standalone on it can not and should not be treated like, or expected to act like an OEM off the shelf car, and for MANY good reasons :-) Off topic now, but... :-)
Marcos, are you alive? No gtalk, no irc, nothing much for days! :-/ I want to sit down with you on skype and chat for several hours and get the BOM/instructions finalised so that they are good enough to tell people to use. This is now of CRITICAL importance as we need people in auckland and the usa to have their boards built and working inside the next 3 weeks, and parts orders take time. Please find the time to sit down and work with me to get this completed. It's now been more than 2.5 months since the boards arrived with you and since you got code running on yours. I can't make progress with the code without people testing it, and you can't make progress with spin2 without people testing your board! Currently neither is happening! This is bad for both of us, and to the point of holding up the whole project now. End rant/beg/plead.
Also, I was thinking yesterday, we *need* some more resistors on the board, this was an oversight on my part (and yours/jareds), but they simply have to go on...
When the device is in bootload mode, all of the pins are in high impedance states. Great, right? Sort of... high impedance + xor input of VERY high impedance = floating inputs. In bootloader mode if i run my finger across the cpu top, only touching the plastic, and only gently, the coils fire up and switch off, as does the fuel pump, and aux outputs, etc. NOT GOOD. I'm sorry for not realising this sooner... it should have been fairly obvious. The solution is to put a weak pull down on all used digital pins such that they are in a known state during bootload. I'm not sure about the value, but it shouldnt take much, 10k seems too strong, 100k might be a good common number and strong enough, I'm unsure. Stronger = load on cpu pins, weaker = less chance of preventing the issue we have. Without this change, a little bit of dust or humidity or something can/will cause bootload to flood engines and burn coils and ignitors... this is what ms does, but it does it for a different reason... I realise that the boards should be coated, but this is definitely still required, hell, the cpu documentation strongly suggests that all unused pins are pulled to 5v or 0v to prevent current draw from switching, these used ones should be too, due to our high impedance boot load state.
On Puma we don't use PORTA much, only fuel pump or similar, for boards with port A and port B being used for fuel outputs, we are probably going to need to pull those pins fairly strongly up or down, possibly using an override chip to control it such that the PORTA reset behaviour doesn't blip injectors. On puma we need a solution for that on one pin, the fuel pump, and any PORTA GPIO pins that are brought out too. Someone needs to investigate this, still, and there are now lots of people with hw that can give it a shot.
So, in summary, 6 port T pins, 8 port B pins, and all the GP pins need pull downs on them, probably 100k. The fuel pump pin needs something stronger or more complex that is yet to be determined, which we should work on soon. I might mod my board to have these pull downs too, as I don't want to have burned coils or flooded injectors because I forget that this design fault exists.
We aren't modifying the bootloader because if we do, we're not compatible with the TA card anymore, and people who don't want or need SMD setups are fucked. And that is totally unacceptable to me, and to many others too. That's why, and it's not much of a restriction, really. You'd still have to do it anyway, as during resets some of those pins are in high impedance state too...
As for fuel pump, yes, we need something on it, but I can't say what yet, the rest of the pins it is simple, but not those PORTA pins.
Preston and I have just been doing some extensive ignitor and coil testing and it's readily apparent that xor alone is not enough to drive those external ignitors and its a wonder that my truck ever ran right with it setup as per ms instructions, or even with the improved XOR setup. Prestons setup will not fire sparks at all with the xor and 280 ohm inline resistance. My hyundai and truck must have been only just working. I'm going to do a separate thread on this, as it requires that much attention. We'll come up with a good design for the outputs that suits all purposes. XOR should stay though for the odd ball ign setups.
And yes, we need to have a chat, and get my photos uploaded and get the docs mint. I have an idea to ease website updates too in the short/medium term.
Fred wrote:Preston and I have just been doing some extensive ignitor and coil testing and it's readily apparent that xor alone is not enough to drive those external ignitors and its a wonder that my truck ever ran right with it setup as per ms instructions
Fred wrote:Preston and I have just been doing some extensive ignitor and coil testing and it's readily apparent that xor alone is not enough to drive those external ignitors and its a wonder that my truck ever ran right with it setup as per ms instructions, or even with the improved XOR setup. Prestons setup will not fire sparks at all with the xor and 280 ohm inline resistance.Fred.
Hi Fred, can you help this "hoon" out and tell me where I can find the schematics for these output configuration? I looked at the "spin 1" schematics and cannot find the xor and 280 ohm circuits. Also, what are the specifications for the ignitors and coils that you are trying to drive?
I apologize if this information is somewhere in an existing thread, but it is difficult for me (as I only have a casual technical interst) to follow the fast pace of hardware / software development for this project.
-Huff
