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Newbee questions on injected LPG for a 289 windsor 
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QFP80 - Contributor

Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2011 12:59 pm
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Just curious - why LPG? I use partial CNG (because it is cheap and clean). But some areas don't sell it.

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Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:00 am
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QFP80 - Contributor
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Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2011 12:27 pm
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Location: Australia
Now I understand.

I can not order from Yoshifab as they dont ship to Australia. LT1 never landed here either so I cant even get that on ebay :(

What code wheels are supported already?
- RB30E is very common, used on many cars here. http://wiki.r31skylineclub.com/index.php?title=Crank_Angle_Sensor
- 1st gen DSM with 4G63 engine (1990–1994 Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, and Plymouth Laser) is available also.


Tue Sep 27, 2011 7:45 am
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I've got personal contact with Yoshi, if you don't mind his pricing, and the shipping, I can *probably* get him to send you stuff. (and I didn't know that)

However, the DSM/mx5 4/2 pattern is well understood by me, and I can knock out code for that in less than an hour, most likely. Certainly not more than a few hours. Likewise all of those Nissan patterns are relatively easy to support, but they're also a little more fickle, maybe an hour, maybe a few days. If you use either, it'll be OK. However, the nissan ones with just four slots, one wide and 3 narrow aren't really a good choice for an 8 cylinder engine, so if you do that, look for a disk with 6 unique inner slots or one from a VH45 with 4 thin and 4 unique, or something.

JONR, I don't know about ozzy, but I *think* CNG is phased out in NZ for safety reasons. I could be wrong though.

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Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:01 am
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BTW, don't rule out the Toyota units either, they are available to you, they are good, they are VR, and provide a decent amount of resolution and if you wire them up fully, and I write some top secret code, you can get good starting from them too. See the first post of this old thread for pics:

viewtopic.php?p=965#p965

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Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:16 am
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TO220 - Visibile

Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 3:55 am
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I would probably advise against the RB30E CAS if you have other options available, they are prone to failure. I'd say this is primarily due to age but some of the replacement aftermarket CAS sensor units seem to be of lower quality than the OEM gear. If you want one to measure up/play with I can probably find a complete RB30 dizzy in the shed to post to you if you want it.

Fred - Remind me to have a chat to you about the Toyota triggering at some point as I have a Toyota-based project that could use a Free-EMS also :)


Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:32 am
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QFP80 - Contributor
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Jonr, would love to go CNG, but there are issues with CNG in Australia. In short the government is preventing its domestic uptake because there is no duty (tax) on it. Commercially its not that bad.

LPG atm has no duty either but over the next 3 years it will kick in.

In Victoria (my state) there is only one company doing cng conversions. By law each model of car needs to be goverment certified before it can be driven on the road, and thats in Sydney (300kms away). need to ship the car there and back again (waiting for the paper work to be cleared) plus the costs of the certification (if it passes the safty and emissions test).

There is only one public fill station (its a truck stop) so you need a private filling system (such as Phil) but that needs to be certified for use and installed by a licensed fitter. Can not import Phil directly as one company owns the certification (yes its company based). Unit costs $3,500 plus install of $800

CNG tanks are small and the range is very limited as they capacity of a bottle is not very high.

All in all, its just not going to work for me, or most people.


Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:42 am
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QFP80 - Contributor
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I dont mind the costs of Yoshi. I should have been more direct, want to you want me to use?

Do you want me to use Yoshi which has existing code or are you happy to develop ? If you are going to support a new pattern do you want it to be FreeEMS CAS disk?

As you are cutting the code, its your choice which direction.

Yeah there are some cheap RB30E sensors on Ebay, I am sure they are lower quality.


Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:00 am
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I want you to use whatever is easiest and works best for you! :-)

I do NOT want you to use the LS1 trigger, that will take weeks of coding, most likely, or maybe a day, but I'd say longer. (tongue in cheek, this is not feasible anyway.)

I'm happy to develop code for whatever type of sensor, more or less, but some have existing code, and some are easier and quicker to get done than others. If you want zero "wait for fred" risk, take existing or easy to write options.

  • mitsi housing with 4/1, 4/2, 24/1 is fine. 4/1 and 24/1 are working and tested and 4/2 is VERY easy to add (just delaying it because of other change that it will just add work to).
  • nissan ones are easy enough to add, but can be a bit fickle, so there could be teething troubles with new code for those.
  • some variation of the freeems cas disk in either mitsi or nissan housing depending on the resolution is fun/exciting to write, but could take slightly longer than 4/2
  • toyota 24/2 vr setup, works as is with 24/1 code, can pretty easily write proper code for it, am happy to do that.
  • missing tooth setup on crank is also fine, that will take a few days to write properly, but is necessary anyway.

Seriously, take your pick and base it on the info above and all will be fine.

Fred.

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FreeEMS.org - the open source engine management system
FreeEMS dev diary and its comments thread and my turbo truck!
n00bs, do NOT PM or email tech questions! Use the forum!
The ever growing list of FreeEMS success stories!


Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:08 am
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QFP80 - Contributor
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Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2011 12:27 pm
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ok thanks, will see what I can get hold of.


Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:39 pm
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oden wrote:
Now I understand.

I can not order from Yoshifab as they dont ship to Australia. LT1 never landed here either so I cant even get that on ebay :(

What code wheels are supported already?
- RB30E is very common, used on many cars here. http://wiki.r31skylineclub.com/index.php?title=Crank_Angle_Sensor
- 1st gen DSM with 4G63 engine (1990–1994 Mitsubishi Eclipse, Eagle Talon, and Plymouth Laser) is available also.


To be clear, the Yoshifab product I bought is specific to Volvo
B21, B23, B230 engines (many B230 engines, specifically those from
700 or 900 series cars may not have the gear cut on the layshaft
to drive the dizzy, they had camshaft mounted distributors, and
require a layshaft swap to use the Yoshifab adaptor.)

It was expensive also, probably the most expensive single bit on
the car so far, but well worth the price.

I expect that Josh would be happy to do some custom work for you,
but you would probably be better served bringing your spare dizzy
and CAS of choice to a local fabricator and having them make
something up for you.

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Wed Sep 28, 2011 7:18 pm
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