1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

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Kennybug
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1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Kennybug »

Fred wrote:
I found the Jaguar A3 HW is quite suitable for my application.
Can you describe your application exactly? Jaguar needs some customisations to use for most applications. List your ideas/build details/setup details here or in a new thread and we'll work out the best approach for you :-) If you try to do it alone without consultation you'll very likely have issues.
I have take time to read all jaguar, Puma & Hotcat development posts during the holiday.
I have an idea to consolidate my application.

I found Andy's Jaguar HW is very nice. Which is compact and neat. Thus i really like the modular layout.
My PCB and Farnell+RS component order are on the way to my office. 8-)
My requirement on FreeEMS is pretty simple & basic:

1 FTDI USB (bus powered) communications (USB-B connector). Running OLV and MTX as gauges
1 Crank RPM/Position VR input connect directly to ECU, with crank mounted Ford type 36-1 teeth wheel.
7 Standard 'CORE' analog inputs (IAT,MAT,CHT,TPS,EXO,BRV,MAP). All using GM standard.
1 ignition advance output to direct drive 2 piece Mit J121 external ignition module & coil packs.(second choice will be Ford EDIS module if I can find a cheap NOS one).
4 sequential injector out put (HI-Z), Using 2 modified Weber IDF style throttle unit.

Here comes my question.
1. how do I connect the 74LS86 output to the 2 Mitsubishi J121?
2. what will be the rpm limitation on current firmware if the Mit J121 used? Is there a better choice available? :?:
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My laser cut 340 stainless steel wheel before alignment fine tune and hole drilling
My laser cut 340 stainless steel wheel before alignment fine tune and hole drilling
My 73 Super Beetle parked outside a temple.
My 73 Super Beetle parked outside a temple.
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Fred
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Fred »

OK, re reading material, quickly forget anything you read about Puma and replace it with a thorough reading of the RavAGE material which is the defacto reference material for the time being until I can document the entire HW design process properly from end to end. Puma is full of wrongness, I hope you didn't take too much of it as a guide :-/ Hopefully Jaguar lead you in the right direction. RavAGE can finish that job, as it is a more complex and complete setup.

With just a crank wheel you can't do sequential injection. You need a cam sync or simply a CAS for that. That said, you're not clear about whether you're retaining the dizzy (you say single output) or going wasted spark (requires two outputs, is supported by the crank wheel setup). If you go wasted, I recommend subaru coils for a flat four or v8 waste spark setup, very neat.

Question 1: You can drive them directly with 5v through 200ohm, BUT, it won't be as good as it could be. It will likely work, but not that well. Better is to drive a FET driver to push 12v to them through a 2w 200ohm resistor, then you'll get proper driver saturation, higher peak current and hotter longer stronger spark.

Question 2: The limitation of the current setup is the missing tooth code, which will be limited between 5k and 6k, the J121 doesn't limit RPM at all. I used them to 8k on my truck.

Information: I don't know if stainless will work! :-( It might, but if it does, not as well as plain steel would, which in turn is not as good as powdered sintered iron. What about reconsidering and putting something smaller inside a housing driven where the dizzy was? Much like what Sim has in his snot rocket using the yoshifab mitsi cas to volvo engine adaptor.

My question: What are your tail lights? Stock? I'm not so familiar with those later cars, but IIRC they are bigger and stick out normally. I love pre 68 cars best :-)

Also, you don't need MAT, it's for later use with smart hot start logic. IAT is all you need if physically setup right.

Fred.
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Fred »

Another thing, are you planning TBI style injection with the injectors and throttles in the centre like a standard type 1 engine carby setup? Or individual units on the side like a hot rodded vw engine usually has?

Both have their issues. The latter is the better choice for looks, performance, sound, etc, but will require you to use TPS based tuning, probably.

Fred.
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Kennybug »

Fred, Thanks for your comment. :)
I will take time to read the RavAGE posts coming weekend.
My basic requirement will be as simple as a MS1 setup. If sequential injection is not allowed without cam sensor.
I will go back to batch injection.
I do not want to keep the distributor. So, i started my work from a 36-1 wheel and a Ford EDIS4.

Sorry that I am a newbie on electronic ignition stuffs. I will need to take some time to real more materials :p .
I had take a look on the Subaru ignition packs, but they are quite expensive locally.
But I had found GM coil packs are selling at a very good price in shenzhen. (for those old Buick GL8)

I know that J121 & J702T will need 2 inputs. are they the same as GM DIS system (Ign advance & Ign bypass)?
I found the Jaguar have CPU PT2 & PT3 output to a 74LS86 XOR gate output. Will this 2 outputs work on J121?

My tail lights are Mexican made flat type junk

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Flat-Tail-Light ... 0556940294
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Fred »

It's not that sequential is not allowed, it's that it's not possible! :-) No need to go back to batch, go banked semi sequential and enjoy the smoothness :-)

I don't like distributors either, it was just a question because you said "one output". Still, with the distributor housing, you could use it to house a sensor setup that gives you the info that you need for sequential and keeps your pulley clean and pretty at the same time. I can't image search right now, but it's possible to find pics of vw engines with CAS units retrofitted around the net and in books.

Subby coils were just a suggestion - the form factor is nice, it's not too important what you use. How you do the wiring is important, though - very.

The inputs that those ignition modules need are not the same as GM DIS, no.

How is your spoken English? Maybe we could have a chat in a day or two when I get back home? I'm trying to avoid typing right now, and it might be quicker to explain :-)

Fred.
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Kennybug »

Great! semi sequential will be good enough 8-)

I need to take time to do a research on the dizzy & cas stuffs.
In my project, I wish to make use of the cheap supply of China parts.
New GM Delphi coil pack cost only USD 10 !! :o

After read the detail application of MTX, I know that the PT2,PT3 ignition output are controlled by the firmware.

My spoken English is fine. I got my first degree in England and I had worked for US company some 20 years.
Next time when your travell to DongGuan or southern China through Hongkong, please let me know.
Let's go for a ride with the Ghia!
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by DaWaN »

Kennybug wrote: I do not want to keep the distributor. So, i started my work from a 36-1 wheel and a Ford EDIS4.

Sorry that I am a newbie on electronic ignition stuffs. I will need to take some time to real more materials :p .
Forget the Ford EDIS stuff, it is nice for slow/old EFI solutions as it needs less realtime processing power.
With FreeEMS you have all the choice, GM coil packs sounds good!

Really love the project, I love the mix of old and new technology :)
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Re: 1973 VW type 1 porn, Carby to EFI

Post by Fred »

Kennybug wrote:My spoken English is fine. I got my first degree in England and I had worked for US company some 20 years.
Great, let's have a chat soon to clear up what ever isn't :-)
Next time when your travell to DongGuan or southern China through Hongkong, please let me know.
Let's go for a ride with the Ghia!
I don't know when/if I'll be back through there. I wish I'd known last time, I'd have been ultra keen. I've never been in a ghia or type3 for that matter!

Fred.
DIYEFI.org - where Open Source means Open Source, and Free means Freedom
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FreeEMS dev diary and its comments thread and my turbo truck!
n00bs, do NOT PM or email tech questions! Use the forum!
The ever growing list of FreeEMS success stories!
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